View Full Version : RAI Milano Siziano on 693 kHz
Hello,
Rai has started test broadcasting on 693 kHz from Milano Siziano Site,
power is 20 kw. Reports are welcome.
Wishes, Andrea
Hi Andrea, all,
I just tuned in, got a signal with up to 15 dB SNR and some audio decoding.
Simone
Signal faded a lot and and did so long and deeply. There was also very strong on-channel AM interference despite my atttempts to minimize it by proper loop adjustment.
At my location, I can't get a usable signal from this transmitter as long as the Voice of Russia is still transmitting on this channel, so I have to tune in after they gave gone off the air.
Transmission was in P-Stereo and audio sounded quite nice, even on headphones.
See attached report with both Dream and DRMSWR results.
Interestingly, the DRMSWR often indicated a higher SNR than Dream.
The impulse response was short and mainly showed only one or two peaks.
Roland
Up here in the North the winner is VoR with max. 14,5 dB SNR and some "audio" . No trace of RAI :(
(Please allow me this fully OT remark: Best QRG of VoR for me - and with better sound quality although in AM - is now newly re-activated Tx at Dresden on 1431 kHz....)
Reception was a bit better last night than it was the night before. I did a bit of loop position adjustment and using another receiver with a built-in ferrite antenna, I also found out that with minimum to Milano, I could hear AM interference from another italian station. According to http://www.hermanboel.be/emwg/online-mw1.htm, this should come from another RAI station in Potenza.
Sometimes, signal was strong but there was also deep fading which, at times, affected only part of the signal's spectrum.
The impulse response didn't look bad, I wonder what kind of TX antenna is being used.
Roland
There is a shadow of a signal, not very good during all the day. Imposible to listen during the day, nor in the nught; sometimes in the twilight.
Ok for the I/O inteface, for the Time Sync Acq, ok for the frame sync, ok for the Cyclic Radundancy Check of the Fast Access Channel, ok for the Service Description Channel, but not ok for the Main Service Channel.
Signal strength was varying a lot.
Also, there is no chance to listen to this transmission here before 23:00 UTC. When I tried in AM before 23:00 UTC, I heard the Voice of Russia, something in italian, a station broadcasting in arabic and more in the background.
There was no loop position which did not bring in an AM station.
Much better after 23:00 UTC when some of these stations seem to get off the air, however there are still some AM signals left. This is certainly not a channel on which to serve a large part of Europe with a DRM signal.
Signal is by far not as good as eg from Vatican Radio on 1530 kHz.
Volume level is higher than on other DRM transmissions but this does not seem to cause distortion.
Roland
The signal from Milano seems to be affected a lot more by long fading periods than what I am used to from signals on higher mediumwave frequencies.
Last night, signal went again up and down a lot and was then often weaker than other on-channel signals, causing dropouts.
Roland
Again a similar result as on previous days.
Roland
tradio99
15-04-2006, 16:02
last night RAI results (22.-23. UTC) - no audio, max.SNR - 11.3dB
Attached is a through-the-night report. Too much fading and on-channel interference but also periods with a good signal. At 05:00 UTC, a very strong on-channel carrier appeared and killed almost everything.
Roland
On a clear channel, this would have been a perfect result even with the same amount of fading. But with so many other on-channel stations, audio drops out easily during fading when interference becomes too strong.
Roland
Hi,
This is my first attempt, and it was not very successful... Perhaps my Beromünster trap for 531 kHz is pulling down 693 too much, need to look into that.
Terje
Roland:
OK thanks, will give it a try later tonight. Perhaps my beloved :mad: Bero"monster" 25 km south from here will have gone off the air by then too...
This is my first attempt, and it was not very successful... Perhaps my Beromünster trap for 531 kHz is pulling down 693 too much, need to look into that.
Hi Terje,
give it another try after 23:00 UTC, because then, some of the interfering on-channel stations, especially VoR in DRM/AM simulcast will have switched off.
I also get almost nothing decoded before 23:00 UTC but quite a bit afterwards.
Roland
Hi,
This is an unattended, timer-started log with Dream from last night. I tried to edit the drmtx.txt to get the distance right to Milan, it should be roughly correct. However, the reception was not a hit. I am not sure how many dB the 531 kHz trap attenuates 693 kHz. Anyway, the log is attached.
Terje
PS: I'm not quite sure what some entries mean in the drmtx.txt.... :confused:
Hi,
The attachment is a part of the log, as there was nothing worth mentioning up until 0440 UTC. I am 202 km from Milan - seems to be an akward distance. The 531 kHz trap was still in the longwire at the UN-UN input terminal. Some decoding in the early hours of the morning...
Terje
Just a short report. Reception would be perfect if there wouldn't be fading and interference from so many stations.
The audio level is still too high!
P.S. TX distance shown in the log is wrong, it is the one to Oranienburg.
Roland
Hi,
Used the Kchibo KK-DRM 01 portable last night. Please do not take this log too seriously... The radio was placed near a window, but I noticed periods of Fading. And then the batteries ran out too.... :p
Some more on the configuration here:
http://www.drmrx.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1147&highlight=kchibo
Terje
Signal again suffered from fading and interference.
Roland
Here is an unattended nightly log right into daylight hours. At 05:00 UTC someone else comes on and makes reception difficult.
Roland
Hi,
This log was originally until 2310 UTC, but I cut it down to one hour (from the start). In the beginning there was some decoded audio.
Terje
It would have been quite a good result if there wouldn't have been fading. Unfortunately, there was, however correctly decoded audio still amounted to 94.5%.
Roland
Siziano's signal suffered from a lot of fading last night.
Roland
There's absolutely no chance of getting any audio from Milano on this frequency before 23:00 UTC, I can't even say for sure whether there is a DRM transmission from Milano Siziano at all before 23:00 UTC. Before that, there is VoR in simulcast (but undecodeable) and a strong arabic AM station can be heard on this frequency. At around 23:00 UTC, audio suddenly appears.
Roland
P.S. Dream's built-in stations dialogue does not show VoR on this frequency at this time of the day but the signal is there.
Am I really the only one who gets audio on this transmission or does no one else try after 23:00 UTC?
Is everybody else distracted because it just doesn't work prior to 23:00 UTC, when the other stations have not shut down yet?
Here is a report on reception last night.
Roland
Hi,
Here is a slightly shortened log, as there was no trace of reception before 0325 UTC.
I believe my long wire with the trap for Beromünster on 531 is not the best solution for 693 kHz.
Terje
Here is a through the night report.
Interesting.
Roland
Very good, the usual co-channel signals were rather weak and RAI's signal was also very stable. Best result so far on this frequency.
But please: Reduce audio level a bit to make it equal to other DRM stations.
Currently, it sounds much louder than everybody else.
Roland
Just a short report, quite good though.
Roland
A lot of ups and downs.
Roland
Hello to all,
Last night's logs : 2 parts because of the need to re-start Dream 1.6.1 after loss of synch. "Best" results obtained here with the Degen TG33 antenna at an azimuth of 010°-190° to avoid local QRM and BBCR5L on the same frequency, though the directionnal effect is very low (with this azimuth, London is at around 70° of the antenna and Milano 30°). If there wasn't the BBC on the frequency, it would be perfect.
73, de Stephane
Signal strength slowly moves up and down a lot and co-channel interference is partly strong.
Roland
Compared with results of other days, I got quite a lot of audio decoded last night.
Roland
FritzWue
11-06-2006, 06:17
First time I see something.
No good frequency for long distance, too much interference.
My first RAI. Also with audio in the first few Minutes...
A lot of slow fading and co-channel interference.
Audio level is far too high!
Roland
Not bad but there were a few dropouts when the signal faded. In between fading, reception was quite good despite the SNR moving up and down.
Audio level is still too high.
Roland
Hi,
An unattended log. Definitely not possible to receive Milano on a long wire in my location. Not much decoded audio during the night.
Terje
Definitely not possible to receive Milano on a longwire in my location.
In antenna terms, a longwire antenna is usually defined as being long with respect to the wavelength, ie a longwire antenna is several wavelengths (or at least several half wavelengths) long.
A 16 m long wire as you are using it, is considered being a short antenna because it is only a fraction of a wavelength long and it will have an omnidirectional radiation pattern whereas a real longwire antenna can be made to have a directional radiation pattern.
Roland
Hi,
I substituted my "short long wire" (I'll call it a long wire anyway, as that is what it is) with a transistor radio tuned to 693 kHz and placed a link coil over the end of the ferrite antenna, making sure it would not load the ferrite antenna too much. The overnight reception was unattended. The result was better than with my 16 m "short long wire" which is connected to the coax line with an UN-UN.
Terje
Here is a log taken through the night. The loop may not have been adjusted to its optimum since I could improve reception in the morning when I re-orientated it at 06:28 UTC to minimise interference as can be seen from the log.
Roland
Another nightly log. This time, I positioned the loop such that its minimum was pointing to England where there are a few co-channel stations. This caused a remarkably better result. At 05:00 UTC in the morning however another TX in the direction of the loop's maximum (Oranienburg?) went on air and killed the DRM signal.
Roland
Not so bad with the loop's minimum now pointing to England.
Roland
Again quite good with the antenna now positioned poproperly.
Although there is no noticeable distortion, the audio level is too high, audio is much louder than from any other DRM station I know!
Roland
Occasionally, there was fading, then co-channel interference became too strong.
Roland
Hi,
I let my Kchibo KK-DRM 01 sit at the window overnight and I got this, not so encouraging result. At least the batteries lasted during the night :D
The audio level is high, very high. But I have experienced even higher on short wave around 6 MHz :rolleyes: .
Terje
Slow fading and interference took its share. Still 92% (too loud) audio though.
Roland
Hello to all,
RAI often offers "good" results here in the early evening -between 1700 and 2000 UT-. Audio quality is very nice. I recorded 9:43 min audio during the 23 min logging time. Many dropouts in the audio itself due to breaks in the studios-transmitter link, I guess. The signal kept on going well, but BBC 693 in AM competes well with RAI in DRM, so none of both stations can be well heard.
73, de Stephane
Just awful!
The content of an audio buffer (perhaps in the modulator) always seems to be sent twice and this goes on and on all the time with interruptions in between.
Listen to the attached MP3 recording.
Roland
It is even worse today.
Hello! Does no one check the demodulated signal from time to time? Obviously not...
Roland :mad:
Just awful and no one takes notice.
Listen to the attached MP3 recording.
Roland
Hi,
Last night the audio was chopped and awful. I put the Kchibo out in the garden this morning and logged almost 50 minutes from 0615 UTC with very good result. Except for the Fading, which caused some shorter dropouts the audio was fine. I noticed that the audio level during the advertising spots was much lower than when music was played. The "much lower" was still about 10 dB higher compared to the BBC or DW.
Terje
I cannot receive a DRM signal on 693 kHz at the moment (23:55 UTC).
Roland
The DRM signal is back today but there is no audio on it, see screenshot.
Roland
FritzWue
03-11-2006, 18:19
A DRM pile-up! :D
First time I saw RAI on 693 kHz with VoR on the same frequency, even got some audio. :cool:
FritzWue
03-11-2006, 22:08
Even more RAI tonight with the loop's minimum to Oranienburg.
Even more RAI tonight with the loop's minimum to Oranienburg.
Hi Fritz,
better try again when Oranienburg has closed down.
Roland
I happened to see RAI on my screen also, and by chance there was more than 10 minutes nearly uninterrupted audio (Live performance of italian chansons and interviews with the artists).
Ooops - somehow the log does not contain all data (?) but I confirm it was RAI.
Although very near to the Tx reception of VoR is very bad here (and when it is successful the "phonecasting" isn't worth listening to).
I will retRAI ;) when VoR is off air in order to see, whom the carrier in the centre of the spectrum really belongs to.
Here is my second try. Although signal looks good DREAM does not achieve even sync sometimes.
Test last night has proven that Oranienburg is not the real problem, but apparently BBC on 693 kHz in AM!
So I can forget this QRG.
Reception at Paris with omniderectional vertical antenna.
Definitely impossible to receive this station without a directional antenna.
A rather weak signal, but like I said before, with a directional antenna results would be better. Just a short log between AIR and H CJB.
Reception last night with longwire antenna.
Deep fading and strong AM-Signal on same frequency.
Quite good for a couple of minutes.
Sound seems to be mono, although it is transmitted in P-Stereo.
Here you can see, it' only mono sound.
Some audio, but not always perfect.
Now they are transmitting in real P-Stereo sound.
Good SNR this night, but lots of fading.
Again mono-sound instead of real P-stereo.
Unattended log.
Very strong co-channel AM-programm when log starts.
FritzWue
01-09-2007, 22:31
A little bit on the loop, unfortunately again a log with zeros.
FritzWue
17-09-2007, 19:14
I can see both with the T-antenna. :D
...but no audio. :o
SNR peaking ~10 dB
FritzWue
02-10-2007, 05:17
Unattended overnight log with a little bit more audio.
Hi all,
there is strong interference from VoR in AM. I used two antennas (ALA1530 and a loop wit 2 m diameter) and a phaser to null out VoR. Drop-outs due to strong fading.
Bernd, DF9RB
petecchiaro
14-09-2008, 06:48
Excellent reception result in urban area using a SONY 7600GR modified for DRM.
Receiver location: SEREGNO (N45.648989, E9.203683) internal ferrite antenna.
mitajohn
23-05-2009, 02:39
Hi all,
There is a strong co-channel AM QRM but I got the attached result for 102 mins.
mitajohn
02-11-2009, 07:43
Hi all,
Here is a 3H35 unattended log.
FritzWue
20-11-2009, 07:53
VoR and BBC in AM on channel, so not much decodable here:
mitajohn
22-01-2010, 23:58
Hi all,
A 45 mins log.
mitajohn
20-02-2010, 01:48
Hi all,
A 27 mins log.
mitajohn
07-03-2010, 00:11
Hi all,
Not bad for about one hour.
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